Dude Gets Chumped By Girlfriend
April 17, 2009 · Print This Article
Only a pussy would say “…and now you’re hitting me!” in a Mickey Mouse I-just-hit-puberty kind of voice. She’s pimp! First a slap then a fist…I want to see what’s next!
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feminist – is that you in the video?
I love how all the little pussy boys on this thread (minus the real men who applaud this amazing video) get all butt hurt and upset over a woman taking a stand.
But it’s semi-understandable seeing that you’ve all probably never had a real girlfriend, and are too busy sucking cock… so please remove the dick from your ass, it’s probably uncomfortable and making you all angry, irritable, whiny little bitches.
Get back in the kitchen.
and the homophobic come to the defense of women!
you go guy, its just as wrong to be gay as it is to discourage assault.
its great that you come to the defense of the once oppressed at the expense of people being currently oppressed, oh well we gotta hate someone right?
i don’t know why people are calling this a feminist or whatever people are calling it. it was funny as hell. guy calls her a bitch. well exact words were. “Now your being a bitch about this.” so she slaps him and he says the whole and now your hitting me thing. anyways. several on just the few responses. mainly the one I’m replying to. i have gay friends. some of them would probably say the whole feminist thing while others would laugh and still not have a problem with a dick in there ass. the other is. I’m glad she stood up for herself and punched that guy in the face. but that doesn’t mean shit. that is just my opinion. that doesn’t make me a man. also I’ve never had a girlfriend so your logic is flawed.
did not see this before but there is another joe on the thread…….i am not him.
What a jerk. He should have hit her back.
I will never hit a woman, but when a woman strikes me, she is no longer a woman, and she will be hit back.
“from very credible sources: psychology, social justice, social problems, and history classes, books and firsthand scientific studies.”
ok so if you have all this hard empirical data, can I see some of it? I’m not calling it false (I unlike you try and avoid gross assumption) but still before I accept something I’d like to see some proof. also either way this doesn’t address his main argument, as I’m betting these stats don’t take the jobless, and they sure as shit don’t take the homeless into account, these demographics add a critical 0 to the average, sinking men pretty rapidly.
“Approximately 1 out of 4 women will be raped in her lifetime”
ok now 2 questions 1) given that you are talking about feminist laws then its safe to assume we can limit our discussion to first world nations that actually implement female rights laws.
now it seems to me that this source probably is weighted pretty heavily by THIRD WORLD COUNTRIES, countries which I bet you’d argue we have no business meddling in. either way I challenge the legitimacy of this source on so many levels its not even funny.
also on an aside, do you think that women and men should be in segregated prisons? for someone evoking the specter of racism so freely it seems to me that you should naturally be opposed to “seperate but equal” facilities.
“Because women are generally less strong than men, domestic violence laws tend to favor them; most men would be able to defend themselves in an attack from their wives.”
“By the way, I would advise refraining from statements such as “you women” or “all women.” There is nothing that’s true about all women (or men, as I realize), and using such phrases makes you sound sexist. :O+”
so this raises a delicate issue bitch, (hey I’m using bitch to refer to your hypocritical ass, and I use bitch pretty evenly among both genders so don’t flip out) because you just made the worlds biggest generalization, just because more women are weaker than men DOESN’T make it a hard and fast rule. for one society encourages men to further themselves physically through the more muscle building sports (football V volleyball, not saying this is how it should be just saying how it is) however I’m a weak male, I’m not ashamed to admit it I don’t have much muscle mass. most women I’ve dated were stronger than me, however having law based around generalizations would make me the more dangerous one in the eyes of the law based on nothing more than my sex, for someone who supposedly wants equality your rhetoric is a little one sided.
secondly your language is actually furthering the gender stratification currently in society, by furthering the stereotype that women are weaker than men and need protecting you actually increase the prevalence of sexism. fun fact most laws keeping the women out of the workplace were “for their protection” (once again I don’t believe that but you just might for all I can tell) to assume that physical size is all that matters robs strong women (the ones feminists are supposed to like) of their agency as it says to all women “oh well handle all this for you, your too weak to handle it” (even if there are more strong men then women, it doesnt change the fact that emphasizing this in a situation where the male showed no signs of physical aggression indicates your willingness to throw this generalization out there) until you know both parties strength YOU HAVE NO RIGHT to evoke the fact that hes stronger, to do so is to fall back on sexist assumptions that because shes a woman she is probably weaker. (fun fact, thats a minor variation on the argumentation used to support racial profiling)
looking for your responses (oh also when you get around to it could you actually give me some sort of warrant for why bitch is as bad as a racial slur used to systematically oppress an entire race, and is still considered a hallmark of slavery? If you don’t have time I understand, you have a lot of work to do carrying on Andrea Dworkins amazing work of defining all heterosexual intercourse as “rape”)
so before you toss around generalizations you might want to think about what you are saying, using such phrases makes you sound sexist. 8==>
if that was a man hitting the woman he would go to jail but because its a woman hitting a man its funny.
My current girlfriend for about 2 years punched me in the face after we were together just a week. She’s 5′2″, 120lbs or so, and I’m 5′11″, 205. Immediately, I lifted her by her armpits to the top of my reach, and bodyslammed her into the driveway. By now, it’s just a joke to us, we are getting married in two months. A woman can say whatever she wants to a man, there’s equality in an argument. But a woman has no place getting violent with a man. if i know you carry a gun, I would be stupid to try and stab you with a knife, and would fully deserve getting shot in the face. i should’ve known better. Same thing for a woman going full force with a man. He would be no more wrong than she was if he punched her back. It’s funny, My girl has socked two of her ex-boyfriends. I worked with one of them, the other I didn’t, but her family says she broke his jaw. So i guess I was in for it from the start. It only took once to put a stop to that shit, though, she never hit me again. And from the look of this vid, that woman could sure use a similar reality check herself.
“Immediately, I lifted her by her armpits to the top of my reach, and bodyslammed her into the driveway.” One small sentence….heaps of ownage.
“from very credible sources: psychology, social justice, social problems, and history classes, books and firsthand scientific studies.”
ok so if you have all this hard empirical data, can I see some of it? I’m not calling it false (I unlike you try and avoid gross assumption) but still before I accept something I’d like to see some proof. also either way this doesn’t address his main argument, as I’m betting these stats don’t take the jobless, and they sure as shit don’t take the homeless into account, these demographics add a critical 0 to the average, sinking men pretty rapidly.
“Approximately 1 out of 4 women will be raped in her lifetime”
ok now 2 questions 1) given that you are talking about feminist laws then its safe to assume we can limit our discussion to first world nations that actually implement female rights laws.
now it seems to me that this source probably is weighted pretty heavily by THIRD WORLD COUNTRIES, countries which I bet you’d argue we have no business meddling in. either way I challenge the legitimacy of this source on so many levels its not even funny.
also on an aside, do you think that women and men should be in segregated prisons? for someone evoking the specter of racism so freely it seems to me that you should naturally be opposed to “seperate but equal” facilities.
“Because women are generally less strong than men, domestic violence laws tend to favor them; most men would be able to defend themselves in an attack from their wives.”
“By the way, I would advise refraining from statements such as “you women” or “all women.” There is nothing that’s true about all women (or men, as I realize), and using such phrases makes you sound sexist. :O+”
so this raises a delicate issue bitch, (hey I’m using bitch to refer to your hypocritical ass, and I use bitch pretty evenly among both genders so don’t flip out) because you just made the worlds biggest generalization, just because more women are weaker than men DOESN’T make it a hard and fast rule. for one society encourages men to further themselves physically through the more muscle building sports (football V volleyball, not saying this is how it should be just saying how it is) however I’m a weak male, I’m not ashamed to admit it I don’t have much muscle mass. most women I’ve dated were stronger than me, however having law based around generalizations would make me the more dangerous one in the eyes of the law based on nothing more than my sex, for someone who supposedly wants equality your rhetoric is a little one sided.
secondly your language is actually furthering the gender stratification currently in society, by furthering the stereotype that women are weaker than men and need protecting you actually increase the prevalence of sexism. fun fact most laws keeping the women out of the workplace were “for their protection” (once again I don’t believe that but you just might for all I can tell) to assume that physical size is all that matters robs strong women (the ones feminists are supposed to like) of their agency as it says to all women “oh well handle all this for you, your too weak to handle it” (even if there are more strong men then women, it doesnt change the fact that emphasizing this in a situation where the male showed no signs of physical aggression indicates your willingness to throw this generalization out there) until you know both parties strength YOU HAVE NO RIGHT to evoke the fact that hes stronger, to do so is to fall back on sexist assumptions that because shes a woman she is probably weaker. (fun fact, thats a minor variation on the argumentation used to support racial profiling)
looking for your responses (oh also when you get around to it could you actually give me some sort of warrant for why bitch is as bad as a racial slur used to systematically oppress an entire race, and is still considered a hallmark of slavery? If you don’t have time I understand, you have a lot of work to do carrying on Andrea Dworkins amazing work of defining all heterosexual intercourse as “rape”)
so before you toss around generalizations you might want to think about what you are saying, using such phrases makes you sound sexist. 8==>
You raise some good questions, I’ll try to respond to them according to the order in which they appear.
First, with regards to the statistics/resources, I’ve just posted them (check old comments).
Next, the rape statistic 1 of 4 women, this was from US women only (sadly). I realized shortly after posting that I neglected to specify. I picked this one up in my social justice psychology lecture, but similar info can be found on my listed resources. If you look at the number of incidents that occurs annually, its not hard to imagine how the number can be so high.
On the domestic violence issue, I was responding to posts complaining about how the woman could get away with slapping the man. There is a whole history of domestic violence where women were the ones who needed the law on their side, and that continues to be true today. The comment offers an explanation as to why that happens, I did not say I agree with it, or that its my philosophy. I was pointing out why less concern is given when the attack is female on male.
However, you’re right that we shouldn’t make assumptions. We have no way of knowing the strength of the attacker/attacked. Just because women are generally less strong doesn’t make it a rule and domestic violence laws should apply equally. (In a later post, I mentioned that it was wrong for the woman’s behavior to be permitted)
Lastly, you question that a gender-based slur is as bad as a racial-based slur. I get called a bitch because I am a woman. Period. I get called a bitch for standing up for myself, for pointing out sexist attitudes, for turning down some lowly guy’s inappropriate advances. I don’t get called a bitch because I’m a hippocritical ass. If I were a man you would not call me a bitch, you’d call me a hippocritical ass. Its the same way with blacks, they get called niggers because they’re black. People make up similar excuses like, those people live like dogs, and *that’s*why I call them niggers, but the racism is obvious.
However, white people can be called niggers just as men can be called bitches. The negative connotation is in association with a *lesser* class. Because words like bitch and p*ssy are associated with women (female dogs/body parts) and are used as a slur, that implies that there is something wrong with being associated with women.
You call me bitch trying to put me down as a woman, and you call men bitches trying to put them down by implying that they are like a woman.
Does that make sense?
Do you still have sex with men? Your boldness is a turn on. Sort of like a wild mustang that I need to break, nah mean?
ok lets roll with the sources, I have a few questions there but I think the real issue is coming down to your hypocrisy and the bitch racial slur connection
for one you accept the hypocrisy argument so id just give up now cause you proved yourself sexist no matter how you swing it.
however on the racist sexist argument I’ve got a few things to say:
1) language critique. Words become less offensive and are devalued with use. the more bitch is used the less it becomes attached to any specific group.therefore if you want to remove the stigma associated with bitch then you should use it more
2) saying that calling somebody a bitch is referencing my negative emotions about women is to say that calling somebody a dick is referencing their negative emotions about men. since I just called my friend a dick 5 minutes ago does this not make me sexist against men? I think not. therefore that means that your argument there is based of the idea that referencing women is somehow different. somehow less than equal? (I argue of course that this doesn’t reference women at all, however your advocacy forces you into this position.)
3) i believe that the word bitch as an insult is a shortened version of son of a bitch, and son of a bitch being an insult to someones lineage (saying they came from a dog) so really this doesn’t link back to women at all. This whole argument is as tired as the whole “we should spell it womyn now because woman is from man”
You pack too much heat beej, she ran off. Do you want an Axe prize pack if we have any left?
sure?
yeah looking at that and most definitely yes. feel free to drop me an email.
Send me your mailing address contact@regretfulmorning.com – boxes get sent the 15th of next month, we’ll toss one in for you.
1.) Language being devalued with use: This is true to an extent, in part because language is constantly evolving. However, even if a word loses some of its punch, it will retain its original meaning for a lot longer, and that still does not mean that it isn’t offensive.
Now, for a word to be less offensive, it has to be used in a positive light, therefore, reclaimed. Using a word to put someone down does not accomplish this, ‘kay?
We see attempts at reclamation in lots of contexts. Some black individuals like to use the word nigga’, women the word bitch, and ignorant country folk the word redneck in a way that makes them proud to own the term. Unfortunately, I disagree with this tactic. Rather than change the meaning of the word, its users embrace the negative qualities of the word. People who call themselves rednecks are proudly ignorant, sexist, racist, and homophobic (and believe me, I know enough of them to say this pretty difinitively). Black people who use the term nigga tend to be less educated, and more immersed in the rap and gang cultures. Women who use the term bitch toward their friends aren’t usually concerned with feminist ideals.
2.) Yes it does. Gender-based slurs promote stereotypes.
3.) Okay, now you’re stretching. If we wanted to refer to someone being less-than-human, why not call them a dog? If the term wasn’t sexist, why not son-of-a-sire? (sire is the name for the male parent, and its no coincidence that it has *way* less negative connotation than bitch). It has no relation to the woman as womyn spelling, which I think is silly myself. It has to do with associating negative images to a female term. Other examples include p*ssy and cu*t, which refer to a body part, but are given meaning beyond that. Why isn’t it an insult to call a man a p*ssy other than to say he is girly?
***Sorry, Jason, I didn’t run off. I’m not even slightly intimidated by the arguments I’ve seen on this post, mostly disgusted. Plus, it seems like arguing with these people is like arguing with a brick wall. They have no capacity for new thoughts, just keep pouring out the same old (and I mean old) arguments. A feminist arguing with a sexist man is like an atheist arguing with the JW that shows up at her door. So, if I discontinue posting, its not because I’m afraid or incapable of an argument, its because I’ve realized that some people can’t be reasoned with. Got it?
Also, you asked about whether I have sex with men: well, why wouldn’t I? I actually can’t get enough. I enjoy role play, risky places (movie theaters and public parks), and I’m also a very *giving* girlfriend, open to new things, if you know what I mean.
Unfortunately for all of you, a guy needs to earn my trust and respect before anything, and I also give as much as I get. So, Jason, even if you weren’t a swine, I can’t imagine I’d put much effort into it. =O
And on a final note, I’m the farthest thing from a bull dyke you’ll ever see. My dimensions are 37″ 27″ 38.” I’ve got hair that goes down to my lower back. Tolkein fans and hippies say I look like an elf, and other people say I look like Julia Styles. To put it in terms you sexist dogs will understand, I’m not a porker or a bull-dyke, I’m an 8.
I’m timid everywhere except in a debate, and in the bedroom. I’ve never hit a man who hasn’t hit me first, and that number is 2: a random guy at a party who grabbed me, and an ex-boyfriend with emotional issues.
I’m a 22 year old atheist with a potty mouth and a bachelor’s degree in psychology.
You guys seem to think that feminists are all ugly man-hating lesbians, which couldn’t be farther from the truth. Chew on that, and next time a feminist comes up to you, maybe you’ll be a little more open-minded : )
O+
I would put a lot of effort into it if you change your mind. Seriously, I’d let you sit on my face after you took a 5 mile jog w/ out a shower with those dimensions.
After you got all cleaned up I’d expect a sandwich while I played PS3 though.
Please check one.
[ ] Yes I want to sit on your face until you spunk all over the place. You can also call me a naughty whore when you drill me balls deep and toss a thumb in my ass.
[ ] No, you’re a chauvinist pig with a small penis. I’d rather eat peanuts out of a turd in Tijuana.
37-27-38? How tall are you though? If your 5′5″ then you are a porker. If you’re 6′5″ then you’re a dude taking estrogen shots. Either way, your still a feminist whore that takes nutshots down the throat. Talk and bitch all you want as long as you’re taking my loads.
alright fine if thats how you want to play it
first some offensive arguments
1) you’ve accepted that you are hypocritical and by extension sexist, even if it’s not full blow out war of the sexes sexist it’s still there. as a result of this you actually create the brick wall that you claim to despise so much. As a biased source really isn’t going to be listened to. And as non-sexists we tend to ignore sexist arguments.
2) “Now, for a word to be less offensive, it has to be used in a positive light, therefore, reclaimed. Using a word to put someone down does not accomplish this, ‘kay?” see its phrases like this that prove to me that you don’t really understand my arguments, nor do you really want to.
See check it out it’s not about turning bitch positive, its about removing the power we give it in our language. if we avoid a word as”the word that cannot be spoken” all of a sudden it becomes all powerful. and actually increases negative perceptions. I’m not saying I turn the word into a positive I’m just saying I turn it less sexist. Whereas you seem to want to live in a world where we are all free and equal, BUT THERE ARE SOME THINGS WE JUST DONT SAY IN A FREE WORLD? Also you never responded to the dick argument. I use dick too does that make me sexist? if it doesn’t then why is the word bitch different unless women themselves are different too?
2) sorry this is a new argument but “People who call themselves rednecks are proudly ignorant, sexist, racist, and homophobic (and believe me, I know enough of them to say this pretty difinitively). Black people who use the term nigga tend to be less educated, and more immersed in the rap and gang cultures. Women who use the term bitch toward their friends aren’t usually concerned with feminist ideals.” WOW! toot toot all aboard the gross generalization train last stop is you! for someone who already admitted to being sexist this does fit your tone, but really? really? you have no idea what you are talking about, I’m from kentucky I call myself a redneck sometimes sure I’ve moved to oregon but I still crack the joke, however I’ve never done anything really racist sexist or homophobic in my life, so I’m guessing the first part of that comment was an insult directed at me…. FUCK YOU! Seriously though, please stop saying these things you just make yourself sound dumb, and also prove my language critique because if more people used these words then you wouldn’t be able to link them back to a specific stereotype anymore because everybody used them. Thereby removing more stereotypes from our language, whereas you want to increase stereotypes because “if you call yourself a redneck you must be a sexist racist homophobe!” real nice.
now on to my arguments
ok onto my arguments and her responses to them.
1) I’ve already pretty thoroughly addressed this point above but if you want a little more consider this. Swear words are now less offensive then they were say 50 years ago. Therefore our society has begun to accept them as words rather than give them undue power over us, she’s the one who’s still dragging us down into the dark ages with her moral policing. Either way this is proof positive that the idea I proposed in my language critique really works. accept it and let’s move on
2) well this argument is one sentence, and very non-unique. Sure it says that “Yes it does. Gender-based slurs promote stereotypes.” but that’s all it says, why thats true, why I’m wrong(is dick really inappropriate too?), or what it means is all left up to the imagination, consider this proof that she has nothing to say to me here and move on.
3) ok this ignores me argument, mostly because sire traditionally has more meaning then just father of a dog. if I said to somebody you fucking son of a sire! would they ever damn well think that I’m talking about a dog? no. that’s why I don’t use it. and secondly on this same argument. I’m not claiming this to be true I’m merely casting reasonable suspicion on your claims, let’s not wholly embrace either argument here. But in that case that really undercuts your advocacy at the knees face slamming you into the ground.
ok onto the argument about me needing to provide sources:
alright folks she’s getting desperate here please note that I only ask for sources of statistics that she provided, if I had a question of her logical warrants then i addressed it logically. Since I make no non empirical or logical claims, then simple logic should be enough to provide weight to my arguments, if she see’s something that I need to source then by all means she should point it out. remember when I asked for a source it was always regarding something specific. She’s merely praying that she can discredit me by yelling that I never provided evidence either. pleas tell me where my arguments would be invalidated without evidence. please do.
also when did I become someone who’s a brick wall who’s incapable of being reasoned with. I honestly believe that I have been reasonable throughout this whole thing, its you with your stereotypes that just keep bringing us all down.
Oh hold on a second, do you see it? oh there it is way out in fucking left field thats where the whole bull dyke thing came from. that and the whole you guys hate feminists thing. No I don’t hate feminism when its promoting equality just because I disagree with you doesn’t make me any of the things you claimed me to be, I never called you a bull dyke either. As far as I can tell you believe that everyone who disagrees with you fits this stereotype you have in your head. Then you throw it out on all of us once again showing your own personal bias and further invalidating yourself, and thus further increasing our reluctance to listen to your hate speech.
P.S. “A feminist arguing with a sexist man is like an atheist arguing with the JW that shows up at her door” WHAT! how am I sexist, thought we pretty thoroughly established that you were the sexist one not me… in that case should we all follow your advice and ignore you? Either way quit trying to typecast me.
PS beej, for someone whining about me not listing sources, you’ve provided amazingly few yourself
Decent punch.
Oh-ho-ho, BRAVO, lovely comments!
Look, if you can deal it, you’d best shut your trap and take it, regardless of your gender, race, whatever. If a woman thinks she’s bad enough to whale on a guy for whatever reason, she’d better not cry “SEXISM!” when he defends himself, and hell, the same goes for a guy beating on a girl.
Gender doesn’t matter; it isn’t an issue unless you decide to make it one.
If a woman is man enough to make a fist and hit with it, she’s man enough to get punched back in the teeth. I know, I’ve done it, and it feels great.
Oh, yeah – and to the dyke posting as ‘feminist’, I didn’t have time to read all your posts, but I expect you’ve either been hit by men too much – or not enough…
Everybody relax, this was staged.
But who was video!? I cant imagine anyone being ok with that sort of argument being filmed by some bystander. Therefore, it wasnt real. Also im pretty convinced that she doesnt use knuckles, but instead a kind of closed fisted slap. Although not totally sure.
Women shouldnt hit men but if they do it doesnt warrant a full on punch back. I’d probably just pin them with an arm lock or something cos I aint gonna get hit twice by some ho. On that note the guy should have seen another hit coming.
Ya’ll still talkin bout this? You could hang out at the trailor park for entertainment and stop paying those high internet bills.
you’re all fuckin’ stupid, just watch the vid, it’s funny, now move on with your lives. feminist, you’re fuckin’ obnoxious.
beej, exactly how did we establish that I’m sexist? I think you’re referencing the fact that I explain the current domestic violence standpoint through its historical and statistical contexts. Are you saying I’m sexist because I say domestic violence and rape are womens’ issues? Because they are. That’s like saying I’m prejudiced for advocating anti-discrimination laws by citing historical and current employment data. Yes, we need these laws and its because minority groups have been oppressed in the past and still have a long way to go in the education/employment sectors.
alright ladies and germs, this should be the last argument that has to be made here. Let’s look at it rationally here, every time she gets up on her high horse she keeps getting knocked back down, note that as the debate has progressed she’s been systematically ignoring every argument that she is losing on. newsflash! just because you pretend it doesn’t exist doesn’t mean that it doesn’t!
she still made hypocritical sexual assumptions something that she admitted to. Assuming that a woman is weaker than a man is sexism folks. Sexism is more than just controlling the other sex.
second of all let’s not forget about her borderline racist, and assumptions in her prior post, those don’t go away when you want them to sweetcheecks. Oh wait let’s also not forget that she is forwarding the “brick wall” idea that she claims to hate, and let’s also remember that she accepted my language critique about removing the power of words. this is also an acceptance of my argument about her trying to become the new morality police. She also accepted the reasonable doubt argument about the origins of bitch so throw out all her offense there. Let’s face it she saw the inexorable hammer of fate coming to bash through what remained of her arguments 2 posts ago, we saw the desperation when she turned to blatant typecasting, calling me a sexist, and trying to obscure the important points with her discussion of her physical features. This was a gambit folks, a gambit that failed. Look at my response. It’s got multiple arguments all warranted in at least one way, all forwarding some sort of advocacy. And what does she do in response? out of all the arguments that NEEDED to be addressed in order for her to prove her point, she chooses to latch onto a postscript. One. Postscript. Let’s talk reality here people, shes run out of things to say, she’s seen her arguments fall around her and shes turned to this last defense. don’t forget everything that’s been said here folks. Let’s put the nail in the coffin on this tired bitch(lets remember I said this not because your a woman, but rather because I now hate you, and you alone with a fiery intensity rivaling a thousand suns) If you need more proof just scroll up.
Wow.
(For some reason your post just now popped up on my screen.) But really, wow.
Everything that I just posted in regard to your argument approach has just been proven doubly true (Originally I accidentally posted only the first part of my response), and you stepped lower than I would have ever expected. What you just posted was not even logical, was not an argument, it was one giant pile of bullying shit you’ve hurled at me to attempt to isolate me from the crowd and turn me into an object of contempt. Kind of what happened to the Salem “witches” and other mob victims. You’re trying to instigate a mob reaction. Wow. I’m actually horrified right now.
Ok first to hit this argument I may not have time to get to your other post tonight (I do have to study for an exam tomorrow) but it seems obvious as to why there was less logic in my last post, this is of course because you didn’t really provide much to respond to, rather I was extrapolating my original arguments as I assumed that the discussion had ended by your small post back there, evidently I was wrong.
And yes I was offensive, but I wouldn’t call it childlike I don’t know how this disgusts you but if it does I’ll keep in mind that “impacts” are something that frighten you. yes I used insults but that’s because at this point you pissed me off with the redneck thing, even if it’s not me, lets look at my grandfather, grew up in rural kentucky, worked on a farm until he was 30 and never received more than an eighth grade education. But I’ve never seen him say one bad thing about a gay, about a woman, or about another race. The difference between you and me is that we both use insults however I try not to attach stereotypes to mine.
Secondly I was doing this thing called impacting out my arguments (debate term 4 years of it sticks with you) I took the arguments that you never responded to and re-contextualized them within the realm of the debate. it helps to clarify and crystallize the round if you will. Honestly what did I say that actually conjured up images of the salem witch trials, please quote me, show me where I did that, if I honestly did then I sure as shit don’t want it to happen again, but in order to do that I would like to be shown where I actually commited such a huge faux paus
also as a final note you kind of isolated yourself from the crowd when you said arguing with most of us (I’ll disclude myself if thats what you say) is like arguing with a brick wall. thats like going to a town hall meeting and yelling “your all ignorant” at the top of your lungs. nothing I could do could single you out more than you already have.
Did your grandpa go around shouting the glories of redneckness? Did he fit the dictionary definition?
You don’t see what was wrong with your last post?
For one thing, you begin speaking to “the crowd” rather than addressing me, secondly you resort to slurs and outrageous claims about my character, boast about your argument being “right” (and you boast to “the crowd”) and generally feed “the people” the story of how you won this epic debate and your unworthy opponent (who is a lowly sexist, racist, bitch) slithered away in defeat, emphasizing to the crowd that SHE’S WRONG! YOU CAN’T LISTEN TO HER!
I think that about sums it up.
But hey, you’re much more human sounding again.
oh i get it, every time somebody addresses a crowd with general statements about how they were right and how their opponent was wrong they are trying to instigate a mob reaction? eh? Don’t quite know where you got off with that one, and yes my grandfather did say that he was a redneck, he fits one of your definitions yet he doesn’t hate on gays, or women, or black people.
PS, you’ve been incredibly hung up on this me-as-sexist thing. You’ve been screaming about me being sexist in every single post because I said “women tend to be less strong than men” REALLY? FUCKING REALLY? That. Is. A. Fact. Its also true that men on average tend to be better at mental object rotation and map reading, while women on average have been shown to have better language skills and emotional intelligence. These things are all true and yet it seems that acknowledging the fact there are some differences between men and women makes me sexist? I’m also going to say that men tend to be taller than women. (OMIGOD!)
You’ve been ranting about that since you started posting, not because what I said isn’t true, (that men do tend to have more muscle mass than women), but because you’ve never gotten over the fact that you’re the exception to the rule. Get some help, and I’m sorry your girlfriends beat on you, really.
No it’s the fact that you defaulted to this stance when defending the girl as she is supposedly more likely to need the help. and second of all if the sexism wasn’t enough what about the racism? or does that not exist in your worldview?
Racism… where do you get that exactly?
well, f*ck. G*d**n tab button.
Anyway, yes I’m saying that domestic violence and rape are women’s issues. That doesn’t make me sexist, that’s a fact. Starting a whole new campaign to stop domestic violence against men would be like starting affirmative action programs for middle-aged white males. Yes, these people can be abused and discriminated against, and such cases should be handled accordingly, but it was never their battle. Please explain to me how this makes me sexist?
You said that swear words are less offensive today as proof that we should use these derogatory terms as much as possible, to which I said, “This is true to an extent, in part because language is constantly evolving. However, even if a word loses some of its punch, it will retain its original meaning for a lot longer, and that still does not mean that it isn’t offensive.” Thanks for completely ignoring that, and pretending I didn’t respond to your argument. By the way, if swear words are so ubiquitous and harmless, why do so many people censor and get offended by them?
And on the dick argument, I didn’t think I’d have to spell it out for you. In my answer, I assumed it was obvious that dick is a gender-based slur. And yes, I do try to make my slurs gender-neutral.
You call this moral-policing. Is it moral policing to point out to people the prejudice in slurs? Because that’s what I’m doing. I get that a slur will offend somebody, that’s the point, but its also good to consider the implications. Do you offend someone by calling them a fagot when your gay bud is around? Do you think its okay to use the term mentally retarted as an insult, when this is an actual condition used to describe certain individuals? (the PC term is quickly becoming developmentally delayed, due to the negative stigma the previous term has incurred) All I’m saying is that we need to think about the connotations of our gender-based slurs.
On the bitch vs. sire thing, why wouldn’t people know what you were talking about? Sire has 3 different dictionary meanings as a noun, where bitch has 4. Why did bitch become the slur in the first place?
I’m not getting desperate. I’m asking you for some facts (guess I wasn’t clear on that). Yes, your arguments are logical, but a correct logical assumption must begin with a fact. I base my logical conclusions on experience and research. What about you? I’ve provided sources to demonstrate that my argument is in fact grounded somewhere, whereas you have merely attempted to create a counterargument by piecing apart my own. I would like some new information, something that has a factual basis. You can go around with logic for years and never reach a definitive conclusion.
On the redneck thing, I’ll start by giving you the definition:
? –noun
1. an uneducated white farm laborer, esp. from the South.
2. a bigot or reactionary, esp. from the rural working class.
–adjective
3. Also, red-necked. narrow, prejudiced, or reactionary: a redneck attitude.
So, yeah, I’m willing to go out on a limb and say that an attitude that is prejudiced by definition is… prejudiced. Redneck jokes and culture also revolve around being proudly ignorant.
Now, I’m not talking about all rural people, after all I live in a rural area. I’m talking about people who actually call themselves redneck. You say you grew up in Kentucky, but admit to moving, and say you call yourself a redneck in jest. I’m not talking about that either. I’m talking about what I said I was talking about: the gun-loving, maybe-has-a-high-school-education, married and popping out babies at 18, “queer-hating” “woman stay in the kitchen” redneck that is recognized as such. And I’ve never met anyone (in person) who calls themselves redneck and doesn’t pretty much fit this definition. These guys also like to tout confederate flags (anybody remember what that war was about?) and say its actually a heritage thing. They can almost get away with that in Kentucky, but I live in Ohio. Yeah. (West Virginian rednecks pull that one too)
beej, you seem to think I was addressing you with the second part of my last post, which is strange because I started it with “Jason…”
On the whole brick wall thing, let me point out that I started posting in response to Shookum’s claim that domestic violence laws are a mark of the US’s “feminazi legal system” and later Saul, who said ” that statistic you dropped 1 in 4 get raped lol, you know how many women- wish, dream, fantasize, and even at times get them selves into rape situations on purpose for the idea of being a helpless victim. women love to pull the victim card, it doesn’t make sense to me, or men, or any other logical creature, but we have all seen it happen”
And I’M the only one whose taking any heat? WTF? Sure seems like a brick wall.
While you have given the most reasonable arguments, beej, you have been less than adult at times. You have been patronizing, condecending, and labeling. You also have neglected to acknowledge that my arguments have any value whatsoever. For example:
“I unlike you try and avoid gross assumption” “toot toot all aboard the gross generalization train last stop is you!” “so this raises a delicate issue bitch” “you don’t really understand my arguments, nor do you really want to” “you’ve accepted that you are hypocritical and by extension sexist” “someone who already admitted to being sexist” “you just make yourself sound dumb” “consider this proof that she has nothing to say to me here and move on”
“that really undercuts your advocacy at the knees face slamming you into the ground”
“alright folks she’s getting desperate here” “we pretty thoroughly established that you were the sexist one” “you with your stereotypes that just keep bringing us all down”
And of course:
“oh there it is way out in fucking left field thats where the whole bull dyke thing came from”
Really? Nowhere? or…
“and to the dyke posting as ‘feminist’” “feminist, you’re fuckin’ obnoxious” “your a child to say the least” “your obviously repeating facts given to you by your mother” “thanks to bitches like yourself” “Feminists are bigots that only mention half facts” “feminist data cooking”
“http://bit.ly/A7LLN” “they need us to protect them, they can never escape that fact, they can easily deny that they act like children and don’t take responsibility for their actions”
“The feminist’s very identity is wrapped up in abortion, not women’s rights orwelfare”
“feminist – is that you in the video?” “Do you still have sex with men?”
(Again, engaging in an argument when the only responses you receive sound like that isn’t at all pointless)
If there wasn’t a stigma and stereotype around the label feminist, why is it that so many people say they believe in women’s rights and equality, yet neglect to own up to the very term that defines that?
I’ve known this for a long time, but it was confirmed in my SOC class last year when the prof. asked us who identified themselves as feminists, and then who believed in women’s equality. Way bigger number on the second one.
“anyway, yes I’m saying that domestic violence and rape are women’s issues. That doesn’t make me sexist, that’s a fact. Starting a whole new campaign to stop domestic violence against men would be like starting affirmative action programs for middle-aged white males. Yes, these people can be abused and discriminated against, and such cases should be handled accordingly, but it was never their battle. Please explain to me how this makes me sexist?”
ok this was never the basis of my arguments their based in your belief’s finding a ground in sexism please reread my first post, and second of all let’s really really really not forget about the racism. seriously granting someone protected status when it comes to LANGUAGE? I accept that we need to fight domestic violence, and that means that more men than women will be punished under these statutes that’s not my argument, its the belief that bitch can’t be said that I find sexist.
“Thanks for completely ignoring that, and pretending I didn’t respond to your argument. By the way, if swear words are so ubiquitous and harmless, why do so many people censor and get offended by them?”
hold up “see its phrases like this that prove to me that you don’t really understand my arguments, nor do you really want to.
See check it out it’s not about turning bitch positive, its about removing the power we give it in our language. if we avoid a word as”the word that cannot be spoken” all of a sudden it becomes all powerful. and actually increases negative perceptions” how is this not a response? seems like one to me. however if that’s not enough sure some people may get offended along the way, when did it not become within my rights to offend somebody? why is somebody getting offended a bad thing? also about the censorship, most of our censorship comes from legislation passed by previous generations, most people of the younger generations are more open to swear words, so yes it tends to move generationally but it is moving nonetheless, for instance my grandma gets pissed when I say damn, My high school teacher let me say fuck in class. thus swear words become more acceptable, not because the emotions they elicit become more acceptable but rather because they lose their connection to those emotions or ideas in the first place. By accepting that language shifts then you accept what bitch may have referenced a while ago may not very well be what it talks about anymore, or what it will in the future. If it really does still use women as its basis (I don’t buy it but whatever) then I am actually trying to remove those references by using it. Go on try it, call me a bitch, do it, I won’t get mad, and you certainly wouldn’t be talking about women negatively (your their defender aren’t you?) yet you can still use it, you can use it and I doubt that hate for women will be apparent behind it. The fact that you can use the word without negative connotations towards women proves that we can actually remove those stereotypes in our vernacular while retaining our language. Truth is it hasn’t been about women for a while, its just about a word being a negative word, don’t try and re-attach women and bitches
also on bitch V. Sire look honestly I read more than the average American and I didn’t know that sire was another word for male dog, I really didn’t until you said it. So really people wouldn’t get what you were talking about. although now that you mention it son of a sire has a ring to it, In keeping with my beliefs ill start using it too.
Also I think you would be hard pressed to find somebody other than yourself who thinks dick is offensive…
and yes it is moral policing to say that a word is not OK to use, when you say that you are making a good/bad judgment that is founded in your beliefs on morality.
Also giant LOL at the fact that you think the civil war was over slavery. Most northern abolitionists didn’t even like black people, lots of them wanted to ship them back to africa.
on the redneck argument I already provided you with the example of my grandfather. is he ignorant in some ways yes, is he proud of it? no, it never says in your definition that they have to be proud nor do they have to be prejudiced, yet you assume that they are. Also you really can’t ignore the whole racism bit to that as well (remember that?) and it’s still patently ridiculous to believe that someone who uses bitch isn’t concerned with feminist ideals, this is another example of why this word needs to become more common its beliefs that the words that you use define you that need to be fought.
“I’m asking you for some facts (guess I wasn’t clear on that). Yes, your arguments are logical, but a correct logical assumption must begin with a fact. I base my logical conclusions on experience and research. What about you? I’ve provided sources to demonstrate that my argument is in fact grounded somewhere, whereas you have merely attempted to create a counterargument by piecing apart my own”
ok for starters ill say this again, note that every time I’ve asked for a source it has been regarding a SPECIFIC THING! if you see something that you believe I need to source, then please quote me and call me on it. don’t just say “it needs a source” find my key premise that you find unbelievable and ask me for a source, I’ll give you one, but you need to actually target it at something. and 2 I’ve done more than just pierce your arguments I’ve turned a decent number of them against you.
finally lest we all forget you still create that brick wall that you claim to hate so much when you say these racist things, thats another fact that’s gone unaddressed.
also whats with the whole “your girlfriend beats on you” thing? I don’t really have a history of domestic abuse on either side of the aisle, really this sounds like your parroting a different version of another posters argument? Surely not, as you found it so objectionable when they said it, what would posses you to turn around and use a minor variation of it. unless of course your a blatant hypocrite.
In closing look to my above post giving my final crystallization, at this point she’s trying to obscure a clear debate to escape. all that prior argumentation exists Don’t let it dissipate folks. by posting in multiple replies and finally deigning to respond to other people she’s trying to step away from an argument with me. Don’t let it happen, at this point shes lost, she can do nothing but parrot old arguments please if you value anything look back at the crystal clear earlier posts and ignore her.
Me: facepalm Did you just declare youself “master of the debate” again? Crystallizing is nothing more than you pushing your interpretation of the conversation onto other viewers.
Okay, one more time.
You don’t see how bitch means woman… Have you *ever* listened to rap music? I’m not re-attaching any meaning, its always been and is still there. Also, you countered my argument by trying to say that bitch isn’t gender-based, not addressing the claim that gender-based slurs promote negative stereotypes. And why did you get so caught up on bitch, ignoring others such as pussy and cunt? Will you also argue that fagot has nothing to do with putting down homosexuality? That nigger, or nigga’ isn’t a race-based term, that calling people retarded isn’t an insult to individuals with developmental disabilities? And that we should use all of these terms as much as possible to remove their meaning? If so, let me start by saying that you’re a mentally retarded bitch-ass fagot, trying to Jew me out of an intelligent conversation. ???
You’re also calling me racist. I’m assuming that’s because I said that nigger is a race-based term. I said that people who use it deny that fact, saying that they aren’t being racist, they’re using the term for other meanings. I then expanded to say that that’s what *you’re* doing with gender-based slurs.
Or maybe it was me saying that reclaiming nigga’ doesn’t work? That’s what I said. Black presidents and elected officials, successful educated black people agree with me. Check out: http://words-of-tha-kid.blogspot.com/2008/08/why-i-dont-bury-word-nigga.html if you don’t believe me.
But really, I give up. I’m no match for your agressive name-calling tactics. If I’m in a corner, its because you put me there by making ridiculous accusations and forcing me to defend them. Its also because YOU’RE the one ignoring the other person’s arguments. I’ve tried to respond to everything as best I know how, the only argument I’ve ever purposely ignored was the claim that income gap statistics should include jobless/homeless individuals. I ignored that because its dumb. It misses the point of the statistic. Also, jobless has several official meanings, both of which would have different impacts, and we tend to view joblessness differently between men and women. A wife without a job is a “homemaker.” A husband without a job is jobless. And including homeless people is even more ridiculous, because so many of these people are dealing with psychological disorders that its more of a mental health issue.
I’m guess I’m sorry for “moral policing.” I’ve always had the bad habit of trying to get people to ask themselves whether something is right or wrong. When I was a kid my mom used to tell me that I expected too much of people; maybe I do…
Anyway, you’re right, beej, I give up. I’m no match for a condescending, accusatory argument, and I’m going to have to admit it. Maybe if I was more of a “bitch”–which for women means domineering and self-serving, but for men means whiny and wimpy, and wouldn’t help me at all–I would have stood more of a chance.
If you feel the need to continue to berate me, one more time declaring yourself “winner” of the debate, that’s fine. I won’t be here.
ok sorry bout the delay, I was off visiting my parents.
Buy anyways, look you still don’t get the idea of the language critique, just because some people still use bitch as woman doesn’t mean that we all do. You are putting a rappers interpretation of bitch on all of us, and preventing us from using the word to our own ends.
Regardless, quite frankly everything that needed to be said has been said at this point, I never called myself the master of debate, don’t know where that came from. But really you don’t care enough to understand the language critique as addressing a straw man is so much easier for you. Either way this argument isn’t going anywhere and it looks like the comments tend to agree with me. I’m through arguing with you, if anybody wants to look back at all the stuff that means that I’m right and your wrong they can feel free to just scroll on up the page.
Peace.
Bad acting + convenient camera angle = Fake video
To feminist:
I respect you 1000x
Lol..you are good!
Need more women like you around..seriously..
I’m a guy and won’t stand for violence against women..not an iota of it..
I call myself a feminist.Most people think that feminism is the female equivalent for male chauvinism, where feminist=female chauvinist
but its NOT…
If you look up the definition for a feminist its “A person who supports the equality of women with men”.Yup thats right EQUALITY…thats what we are fighting for..
I don’t speak for women who use feminism as a means to get SUPERIORITY over men.Girls with low ideals, who don’t actually even know the meaning of feminism and just use it as a buzzword for men bashing and women worshiping.Those pampered Paris Hilton wannabes that think they women should be given a demigod status as their birthright.While women folk suffer in Arab countries, destitute of even the basic rights.They give us true feminist a bad name.Equality among genders..YES!..Superiority?..No way..
Given a situation like that what would I do if I was dude in the video?
I wouldn’t hit her back.Yup eventhough she slapped me, I wouldn’t raise a finger on her.I’ll just walk away forever.
No cajoling or anything hereafter by that girl, her tears or apologies will work..No matter how much I love the girl or how dear to me she is.No second chance.Period.Its a matter of principle.
Its not that I can’t hit back or that I’m weak…. it just that I won’t..It will only happen over my dead body.Its a matter of principle.And I won’t differ from in no matter what! Just like me being vegan, non-smoker, tee-taller-its all a matter of principle.Nothing else matters.
But then again I will never let it escalate to that magnitude.Most of the women I move with know my character.And never push it.
As with my nature I speak very little.
But when an argument as such arises and things are getting out of hand.I just have to look at them in the eye, raise my voice and say their name is enough to make them stop dead in their tracks. They will just freeze.And the next instant they will be like “I’m so sorry…etc..” trying to cool me down.
Its respect.They are not scared of me, and they all know that I will never hit them or raise my finger no matter what they say.But when I say stop, its enough to make them stop instantly.No raise of hand, just one word.That all.That’s because I respect them, and they respect me.Its a two way street.Give and take respect.If I’m wrong, I’m the first one to apologize, its a habit.
But If they are wrong, I won’t say it.
As for me, women simply amazes me.In my dictionary they are gods and I worship their existence.As I always say, “between the divine and the diabolical lies women” They can be the sweetest most angelic thing on the planet or the totally opposite.I celebrate women.Amen to them. =)
My mom is visiting and I just showed her this thread. She said the woman in the vid was wrong and she also said it would be funny if you and beej met irl and fell in love. (dead serious)
/discuss
ha ha, I like your mother, it would be funny, but if that was her face that used to be her gravatar then I think that I can do better.